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 HE-MAN trivia

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Dan
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PostSubject: HE-MAN trivia   Mon 15 Oct - 22:38

HE-MAN AND THE MASTERS OF THE UNIVERSE was my favourite cartoon show when i was a little boy. In the HE-MAN trivia on IMDB, it says Mattel was originally going to make a CONAN toy franchised, but the idea was dropped because of the film's R rating and CONAN inspired MATTEL to create HE-MAN toy franchise.
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Flaming Turd
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Tue 16 Oct - 2:26

It's a lie.
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Cromulus The Destroyer
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Tue 16 Oct - 6:07

You should watch Thundar the Barbarian, it nearly reminds me of Stone's CONAN vision,lol.
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Tue 16 Oct - 9:18

I read that the project was to create toys of Conan figures, but that they tested a blonde one too on kids. This last one had more succes than the other : then He-Man was born. Later, when a law that prevented to create cartoons based on already existing toys was abrogated, the new cartoon was made.
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Cromulus The Destroyer
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Tue 16 Oct - 16:48

Yeah, we hear different versions of the tale. I remember MightyMcT showing me some kinda court transcript I think it was, dunno if it was real or what exactly it said because it was a while back now.
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Tue 16 Oct - 17:10

Here we go:
http://www.robert-e-howard.org/AnotherThought2.html

study

_________________
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Dan
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PostSubject: THUNDARR is CONAN   Tue 16 Oct - 19:25

I find it very hard to believe. I really cannot see the connections between HE-MAN and CONAN. I think THUNDARR THE BARBARIAN is more like Conan.
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rocqu
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Wed 17 Oct - 0:15

This should help answer this question strait from the horses mouth.

http://trex.id.iit.edu/alumni/interviews/sweet_interview_sep05.html

Quote :
So you designed the entire He-Man property yourself?

What I always say is, I originated and named He-Man, and originated the general concept of the Masters Of The Universe. I constructed three prototype figures at nine and a half inches, which I first showed at a product conference at Mattel in late 1980. These three prototype figures brought He-Man into existence. They were all of He-Man in different themes and configurations. One had a barbarian theme from the ancient past (low tech), another had a current military enhanced theme (mid tech), and the other one had a futuristic military, a la Star Wars, enhanced theme (high tech), showing that He-Man can go anywhere, and do anything, at any time, in any theme. These figures were nine and a half inches tall, and the figures in the line from 1982-87 [photo at left] were five and a half inches. But I knew if I showed these figures at the height they ended up being, I would have a very poor chance of selling the concept, so I made them very tall, huge, and very impressive.

I read that Masters sold 55 million figures. In all its different product variations it sold supposedly over $2 billion worth of product. I also read that the Mattel Masters product sold $1.2 billion world-wide, and over $800 million of that was in the U.S.

I think the confusion comes from the highlighted quote above.
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Flaming Turd
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Wed 17 Oct - 15:46

I believed that myth too, when I read it somewhere some time ago. I must say I WANTED to believe it. It was too cool to ignore it.

But if you go to WIKIPEDIA and search for info about "Masters of the universe" tys, you will find the original creator of the toys released the truth about the rumor: it's a lie. He-man was not originally going to be a Conan's movie toyline.

So, end of the dream.

It's true that Skeletor is obviously Thulsa Doom (but the one from the Kull's Marvel comics) and it's true that He-Man was originally in the comic books that came with the first toys a barbarian from an ancient planet, not a gay prince with a sword with the power of turning him into He-man. Originally, He-man was born like that, and was a wanderer.

But, hey, in the 80's there was A LOT of barbarian comic books and novels and the image of Conan was already in the popular culture. It's not so weird that Mattel thought about a barbarians toyline.

We must remember, the Millius' movie didn't started the barbarians mode. It existed before the movie was filmed.

Sorry for popping your bubble. It was dissapointing for me too. But I choose reality. I'm too old for shit now.

Wink
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Einar
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Wed 17 Oct - 16:23

So, FT, what do you make of this :

Quote :
In 1980, CPI, through its agent, Conan Licensing Company ("CLC"), began negotiations with Mattel regarding the possible licensing to Mattel of certain toy rights in CONAN. During this time, Mattel received a substantial quantity of material on the CONAN character. On July 31, 1981, CPI and Mattel executed a License Agreement whereby Mattel was granted "the right to make and sell certain plastic action figures of CONAN and ancillary characters as depicted in the CONAN movie."

(from the link MightyMcT posted above)

You think this is bull ? scratch

I say when there's smoke, there's fire !

Don't you know that Edward R. Pressman who launched the whole CONAN filmproject, originally comes from the TOYS business ?

Come on !!! Ever heard of " Pressman Toys " ? Rolling Eyes Mr. Green

This guy who created He-Man says he was not inspired from Conan, and that's it, everyone just has to believe him, just like that ?

I think things are a little bit more complicated than that !!!


The guy worked for Mattel, what would be his interest to tell the world he just transformed Conan into a blondie ?

viking
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Cromulus The Destroyer
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Wed 17 Oct - 18:45

He-Man looks to be wearing the same belt:






Also note that He-Man is using the same spiked wrist piece on his left arm, same as CONAN wears on his left forearm:


....and of course He-Man was rip off of CONAN, along with Superman and Star Wars(along with Thundarr the barbarian which itself was based off of CONAN too).
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Nexus6
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Thu 18 Oct - 4:06

Not to mention that Wikipedia cannot truly be used as a reliable reference. Anyone can modify a Wikipedia entry. Hell, I can go to it right now & change all that info about Masters of the Universe so that it reads the exact opposite.

I'm not saying, I'm just saying...
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Flaming Turd
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Thu 18 Oct - 8:39

Of course I DON'T KNOW for sure Rolling Eyes Didn't know about that Pressman Toys Mr. Green

There's this thing that I find extrange. The reason why it changed from Conan to He-Man differs from version to version. Some says they realized the movie was too mature oriented for children... How the fuck would they realize the movie was before it was filmed?? Oh, yeah, sure Mattel received a copy of the early script. tristme Shit

Others say that "when it came time to test-market the character sketches to children, the kids liked a blonde-haired version better than the real Conan. Mattel decided to create their own character based on the preferred sketch and named him He-Man". This one sounds so silly, so stupid.. that is probably true Laughing Nah, seriously, scratch I don't buy this crap either.


You are right, Einar, things are more complicated than "yes" or "no". I think this version could be more close to reality.

Quote :
"There is an enduring urban legend about the so-called "Conan toy line". The story is that the Mattel Toy Company originally intended to base an action figure line on Conan the Barbarian, the pulp fantasy character created by Robert E. Howard which at the time was the lead in several popular series produced by Marvel Comics and due to be the subject of a major movie. However, after viewing the film, the Mattel executives despaired at the thought of promoting a children's toy with ties to a film featuring such graphic sex and violence. Thus they gave their doll blonde hair and re-dubbed him "He-Man". The legend is unverified but persistent, and most likely false since the first He-Man action figures were produced in 1981, a year before the first Conan film. Roger Sweet, the originator of He-Man, asserts that the He-Man/Masters Of The Universe concept definitely was not an outgrowth of Conan. The He-Man concept, later renamed the Masters Of The Universe, was originated and developed by Roger Sweet in late 1980. Later, that initial concept was followed by the original comics by Donald F. Glut. The Conan license had been dropped by Mattel months before the He-Man concept was begun. At that time, the barbarian fantasy theme, later applied to the He-Man/Masters concept and line, was broadly visible notably in Frank Frazetta and Boris Vallejo barbarian fantasy art - not specifically from Conan".


The fact is if there really was negotiations about creating a Conan Movie toyline, or not. That is the point.

I am sure the creator of He-Man had Conan in mind, conscious or unconciously. Of course. Any one who creates any barbarian has Conan in mind, in any way. It's the reference. But it doesn't mean he was doing a blonde Conan. It's not the same thing.

I say, the point is if there really was a true project of making plastic Ahnulds or it's shit wrotte by some bored without life fan.



(I used to play with my Masters and my Evil-Lyn... poor girl, too many barbarians for only one witch) pig Mr. Green Mr. Green
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Cromulus The Destroyer
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Thu 18 Oct - 9:27

I doubt kids found the blond hair more attractive, thats a rather odd answer.

Looking back on the design though, its rather shitty. Has that terrible pageboy haircut(cross between Prince Valiant and Windsor-Smith's Conan), fur speedo, and beach blond homo look.Also Prince Adam surely put that question to rest, that guy dressed in pink.

I'am reminded also of why I didnt like old CONAN comics and CTD all that much. I always preferred Knight armor or Greco-Roman tunics and armor and such, rather than male bakini's .

I know with the recent re-release of the Masters of the Universe line, they dropped that Cross, because supposedly they felt it was to quasi-Nazi looking.

PS

I believe He-Man was also a take-off of Ka-Zar from marvel comics fame, another blond male in a fur speedo that ran around with a giant Tiger friend and was in a land mixed of Stone age and futuristic settings.
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Dan
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PostSubject: Snake Moauntin   Thu 18 Oct - 22:37

One He-Man and Conan connection i see is Snake Moauntin. Snake Moauntin was Skeletor's layer. In CONAN, Thulsa Doom is the leader of the snake cult and his fortress is called ''The Moauntin of Power''.
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Thu 18 Oct - 22:42

Dan wrote:
One He-Man and Conan connection i see is Snake Moauntin. Snake Moauntin was Skeletor's layer. In CONAN, Thulsa Doom is the leader of the snake cult and his fortress is called ''The Moauntin of Power''.

As is known, Skeletor was based off of Marvel's Thulsa Doom, which was more like Howard's version, which was a Skull faced evil Sorcerer.

Marvel comics undoubtedly had profound influence with He-Man, both before and after, they also went on to write the comics.
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Thu 18 Oct - 23:19

The snake-men and the Snake mountain are concepts from 1983 or even more. Millius' Conan was released in 1982, and by that time the theorical Conan toyline idea had been abandoned.

The original first toyline (1981-1982), that is, the inmediate designs that could came after the hypothethical change from the Conan movie toyline into He-Man, was like this:





Plus the Battlecat plus the Grayskull Castle.

This would be the roots of the original concepts for the toyline. If there is a Conan movie connection, it should be there. We have the little comics that came with the toys. Yes, He-Man is a prehistoric savage who turns into a warrior. Skeletor is more like a spirit of darkness who wants to rape the Greyskull's secrets. No real Millius movie connection here.

Another important thing to note is that TEELA, the good girl, IS A SNAKE PRIEST. So, originally, the snake cult was in the side of good, not related to evil. So, another high difference with the movie -and even with the comics or Reh stories.

And no character of this toyline, but maybe He-Man or Skeletor -as Marvel Kull's Doom- could have a real connection with the Millius movie. Battlecat... no... Castle Grayskull... nope...



But I insist: if you want to see a conection, you will see it.

But there are A LOT of other possible influences for He-Man beyond the Millius movie. See thousand of comic books and fantasy novels, since the sixties.

Well, whatever... I would like to find the rumor is true. Really.
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Cromulus The Destroyer
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Fri 19 Oct - 1:38

The Snake-Men didnt arrive until the mid/late 80's, under the leader of King Hiss.

Also you cannot forget about GI Joe's Cobra Organization and S.H.I.E.L.D's Hydra Organization. So you had alotve Serpent orientated villains in those days, also to mention that Conan was very popular in the 80's , both the movie and the comics.

Morever just look at Mumm-Ra from THUNDERCAT's, check out his logo too..clearly Cult of Set inspired. Cool









And why not Voltron's enemies from the planet Doom:



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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Fri 19 Oct - 17:32

FUCK! IT'S TRUE! Shocked Shocked Shocked



GREAT DISCOVERING, CROMULUS!!!!!!!!! thumleft thumleft thumleft







Hm, Cromulus, or anybody, do you know when the final script for the movie was wrotte?

Because, if there was a Conan movie toyline concept, what material would have been avaiable for Mattel to be used as a reference, at that time?

They say this:

Quote :
During this time (1980), Mattel received a substantial quantity of material on the CONAN character.

So, if I am not wrong, the first draft of the Oliver Stone script was wrotte in 1978. Does anybody own that jewel? Cromulus?

Is there something there that could fit with the He-Man toyline?

Because it's obvious that the final version of John Millius has little to do with the Masters of the Universe designs and concepts.


Also, the reason why they Hypothetically changed their minds from Conan to He-Man, is very unclear. Let's put some light there.

If they knew Conan from the comics or novels, how could Mattel not realize how violent and full of sex was the world of the character? And, is not the Oliver Stone script, or the whoever script they could have read at that time 1980-1981 already full of sex and violence????


And... Is the script of an unreleased movie going to be sent to a toyline company????

scratch

Man, I don't know...


And, years after He-Man, came "Conan the Adventurer", the proof that Conan, besides being a mature oriented character, could perfectly be transformed into a child friendly cartoon and toyline.

I don't know. Why the creator of He-Man would lie about that fact???? Why??????

shifty Internet is full of shit. Rolling Eyes
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Cromulus The Destroyer
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Fri 19 Oct - 21:43

The 2nd draft was out and around by Nov 1980, and is basically identical to the 3rd draft.

Masters of Universe was just mix of everything really which was popular in those days.
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Einar
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Mon 22 Oct - 14:18

More important than the script or synopsis or any outline or treatment, Mattel surely had access to lots of preproduction drawings and paintings and designs, from Cobb/Stout et al... study
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Mon 22 Oct - 19:35

Then... hm...

Why the masters don't look like anything in the movie? No resemblance at all...

And how did they realise how violent and erotic the movie will be? By the sketches? Hm...

Hey, let's kidnap the creator of He-Man and torture him till he reveales the true truth. Rexor Mr. Green




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Cromulus The Destroyer
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Mon 22 Oct - 19:43

The Conan likeness, is more from the comics. Even Remco's Conan official release bears resemblence to the Marvel Comics, and even He-Man and yet none to Arnold.





But rated R movies getting toylines, really isnt that outlandish, even for the 80's, just look at Robocop.
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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Mon 22 Oct - 20:08

"Conan the King" wears something that looks like the He-Man chest... armour?

But, hey, look, Arnold wears it too:





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PostSubject: Re: HE-MAN trivia   Mon 22 Oct - 21:42

So, what happened to the "It's a lie" guy, Flaming Turd ? Rolling Eyes Wink
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